[20:51] Jeffronius Batra: Too late for the Xanadu discussion?
[20:51] You: no, not at all
[20:52] Jeffronius Batra: cool. I have a first edition version of Computer Lib / Dream Machines...
[20:52] You: me too
[20:52] You: I found it at a used book store for $5
[20:52] Jeffronius Batra: I followed the Xanadu and Udanax stuff for a while but it always seemed way too complicated
[20:52] Jeffronius Batra: I bought my book from Ted Nelson at the First West Coast Computer Faire in 1976
[20:53] You: they are working on a new simplified design
[20:53] Jeffronius Batra: Wow, I thought that they had given up hope.
[20:53] You: no, there are still a few people working on it
[20:53] You: they are re-doing it in Python
[20:54] Jeffronius Batra: Interesting. Is Ted involved at all?
[20:54] You: I am trying to learn to program in Rebol
[20:54] You: yes
[20:54] You: Ted is at Oxford University in London
[20:54] You: and still working on it
[20:54] Jeffronius Batra: Really? I am speaking there in a couple of weeks at the XML Summer School.
[20:55] You: he said in an email a few days ago that there may be some new software out later this year
[20:55] You: at Oxford?
[20:55] Jeffronius Batra: Yes, Oxford.
[20:56] You: wow, that's great
[20:56] Jeffronius Batra: http://www.xmlsummerschool.com/
[20:56] Jeffronius Batra: Yes, it should be fun.
[20:56] You: you can probably see Ted there then
[20:56] Jeffronius Batra: I will try my best.
[20:57] Jeffronius Batra: It is interesting to see how complex ideas like the original Xanadu are simplified until they are actually implementable.
[20:57] You: I have been reading some database information today
[20:58] You: some people have extracted some of the ideas from Xanadu to use in database design
[20:58] Jeffronius Batra: What in particular?
[20:59] You: at http://lazysoft.com
[20:59] You: I read about it on the Rebol mailing list
[20:59] Jeffronius Batra: I will take a look later.
[21:00] Jeffronius Batra: I do think that 3D virtual stuff like SL provides an even more interesting model for finding and organizing info.
[21:00] You: I don't know enough of the details yet, just heard of it today, but it is an alternate to relational and object databases
[21:01] You: yes, there is a lot of data being linked under the surface here
[21:02] You: It is fascinating to think about what new developments are possible in SL
[21:02] Jeffronius Batra: Yes, and the fact that other people can be "in" the data at the same time opens the door to some fascinating possibilities
[21:03] Jeffronius Batra: When I show SL to most people they think it is a game, and won't see past that to the collaborative possibilities.
[21:03] You: yes, I would love to be able to zoom down to the molecular level or up to the galactic level in VR
[21:04] Jeffronius Batra: I think we will get there. I was reading about Croquet and it sounds like it could do what you want.
[21:04] You: yes, there are a lot of things that could be done
[21:05] Jeffronius Batra: So far I have found that the "older generation" (I'm 46) may be a bit more open to this for some reason. Can't figure out why.
[21:06] You: I think it may have something to do with wanting to archive the past
[21:07] Jeffronius Batra: Yes, that could be it. BTW, I see you have an ISS shirt on. Did you watch the Shuttle launch in SL last week? that was wickedly cool.
[21:07] You: or just seeing the connections between everything in a systematic way
[21:08] You: no, I was working that day
[21:08] Jeffronius Batra: It was awesome. I put some photos on my blog at http://www.jeff-barr.com
[21:09] You: oh wow
[21:10] You: those pictures are amazing
[21:10] Jeffronius Batra: It was a very social event.
[21:10] You: yes
[21:10] You: going to the Space Museum brought back a lot of memories
[21:10] You: I used to live in Florida
[21:11] You: my aunt still has a beach house at Cocoa Beach
[21:11] You: I saw a moon shot go up from 80 miles away once
[21:11] Jeffronius Batra: A lot of people at the launch had recollections of Gemini and Mercury, we talked about Tang, Space Food Sticks, etc. It was genuinely fun.
[21:12] Jeffronius Batra: I watched those moon shots on TV as a kid.
[21:12] You: 5 minutes later it shook all the windows in the house
[21:12] Jeffronius Batra: I'll bet. Those Saturn V's were amazing for then, and would still be so now.
[21:12] You: yes
[21:13] You: I read about the building of the second stage
[21:13] You: it was a hurculean effort
[21:14] Jeffronius Batra: I'm sure. The next generation (Space Ship One, space tourism, etc) will be fascinating to watch.
[21:14] You: I drew some diagrams the last couple of days comparing Xanadu to wikis
[21:15] Jeffronius Batra: Are those on your site?
[21:15] You: yes, I want to see some colonies in space, even a small one
[21:15] You: yes
[21:16] Jeffronius Batra: I work at Amazon.com and we use a lot of Wikis, but more for factual data. A lot of what you have there is very accurate, but more applicable to situations like Wikipedia where there are lots of opinions about the same subject, some of which conflict.
[21:16] You: http://hyperworlds.org/mindmaps/XanaduWiki/FormatEdit.html
[21:16] Jeffronius Batra: (found it already :-))
[21:18] You: I think a lot of the concepts in wikis and Xanadu overlap, but there are still some important differences
[21:20] Jeffronius Batra: having strong identity of authors would be a big step forward for many online collaborative environments.
[21:20] You: yes, there is so much material that just won't work in a wiki
[21:21] You: and a lot of what is sold at Amazon would never make it in a wiki
[21:21] You: so many people need to get paid for their work
[21:22] You: movies, music, and books
[21:22] Jeffronius Batra: Agreed, it does pay the bills.
[21:22] Jeffronius Batra: But some of those creative types could find good homes and earn some L$ inside of SL.
[21:22] You: when you leave out all their efforts, that limits you a lot
[21:23] You: yes, some do already
[21:23] Jeffronius Batra: Performing, selling limited edition artifacts, appearances for hire, etc.
[21:23] Jeffronius Batra: I was browsing slboutique.com and saw items selling for US$10 and more.
[21:23] You: I will have to check those out
[21:23] Jeffronius Batra: They are not all "family friendly"
[21:25] Jeffronius Batra: Ok, I need to call home and check on my family. This has been fun and I really enjoyed chatting with you!
[21:25] You: yes, SL does have a certain culture
[21:26] You: yes, may I publish this chat on the hyperworlds website?
[21:26] Jeffronius Batra: Sure, be my guest.
[21:26] You: OK, thanks
[21:26] Jeffronius Batra: Later...
[21:26] You: later